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Big Little Podcast Episode 40: Dollification

Released November 20, 2011

Hosts: Spacey, Mako, Mae

Guests: Kit Koppela

Transcribed by Valentalae. Transcriber’s note: I've indicated having no idea what someone said with a set of ellipses and question marks: “…???” Fortunately I didn’t need to do this too often.


Lilly: You’re listening to the Big Little Podcast, a show by, about and for age players of all kinds. We expect our audience to be mature, consenting adults, because sometimes the topics on our show are pretty adult too, just like you. If you’re under 18 and looking for up front advice about sex, please visit Scarleteen.com.

Intro music

SPACEY: Welcome to the big little podcast, the show by, about and for age players of all kinds. I’m Spacey, and I’m here with my brother Mako.

MAKO: That’s me! And we’re here with our lovely co-host Mae.

MAE: Yay!

SPACEY: Hooray!

SPACEY: And we have another special guest with us tonight.

MAKO: That’s right.

KIT: My name’s Kit.

MAKO: And tonight we’re going to toy with our guest as if she were kind of a plaything.

SPACEY: Indeed. Our little dolly.

MAKO: Cuz that’s what we’re talking about, dollification.

MAE: Yay!

SPACEY: Yeah, I’m really excited to do this show because…

MAKO: We’ve wanted to do it for months.

SPACEY: Yeah, I mean it seems like it has so many obvious overlaps for age play to me, and Ii don’t wanna steal any thunder so we’ll get into that shortly. But, maybe I’ll tell you about my first experience having witnessed doll play, sort of a public setting. It was at an event called Beyond Vanilla in Dallas Texas, and Mommy and I actually went there because they have a big puppy convention. It was a lot of fun to go play with the puppies and that kinda thing. But, when we got there, fortunately the puppy convention and the rest of the regular kink convention was sort all one big mishmash thing and you could pretty much do anything you wanted. So they had sort of the main area had some shows going on, but the thing that attracted me was that they were doing this fundraiser for charity about… They had this big giant seesaw so I was riding this big giant seesaw for like half an hour to an hour. Which was only exciting to Mommy for a short period of time, so I went and did the seesaw thing for a while and she went and did her own thing, but they had this show that they started up while I was on the seesaw, and it started with this boy coming out and this girl coming out. And they were all kinda silly and dancing around and all of a sudden this boy couldn’t move very well, and all of a sudden this boy was being dressed up in these frilly outfits and they were all super-duper cute, and the song that I’ve heard over and over since then any time I see something like this was Coin Operated Boy.

MAKO: (Singing) Cooooin, operated booooy…

SPACEY: And I thought it was awesome! Especially the little dress the girl was putting the little boy in was like super cute, this little black dress with pink lacy frills and that kinda thing. I was like, “Aaaah. That looks so little kiddish and fun!” So, I wanted to do that. And ever since then I’ve been incidentally fascinated by doll play.

MAKO: So tell us about it Kit.

SPACEY: Yeah, so what is doll play? Was what I witnessed doll play?

KIT: Um, yeah. It seems like what it was, it could’ve also been a sort of dollification, sort of sissification type thing. Kinda depends on those people, like, how they define dollification because there’re so many different options. I mean, how many different options are there for saying “I’m a little?”

SPACEY: Ah just one, my way.

Everyone laughs.

MAKO: (buzzer sound)

SPACEY: Or not.

KIT: There’s 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10…

SPACEY: 11, 12…

KIT: Ya know, and then everywhere in between. So…

SPACEY: I agree.

KIT: Yeah.

MAKO: Well can you give us kind of a wide survey of different kinds.

SPACEY: Yeah give us some numbers.

MAKO: Yeah.

KIT: Wide synopsis, um. There’s a lot of people who are into latex or rubber dollification. It can encompass the inflatable crazy costumes that some people like, with the masks and the crazy hair pieces. There’s also gothic Lolita dollies. There’s porcelain, there’s Barbie, there’s sex dolls, there’s rag dolls, ya know. Basically any kind of toy you could think of could be incorporated into dollification. Oh and action figures also.

MAKO: I’ve heard that and, robots too.

SPACEY: Ooh! Karate chop action figures!

MAE: That’s what I was saying earlier.

KIT: Yes, robots. I mean, why can’t you have a GI Joe doll? I see people …???

SPACEY: I can see where a kung fu grip would come in handy.

MAE: I’ve actually seen this great commercial where this father is trying to get his little boy to play with GI Joes, and he’s like, “Barbie Barbie!” And later you see him asleep with this Barbie and he’s having this dream of these two blonds with pink lingerie and then in the other room there’re these gay military leathermen having a tea party.

MAKO: Laughs.

MAE: Best common commercial ever.

MAKO: Awesome.

SPACEY: It does play a little bit on homophobia but other than that it’s pretty funny.

MAE: A little bit yeah.

MAKO: Well ya know what though, it does beg a question, right? Like all this doll action figure stuff, how much does it overlap with age play? Is there dollification that’s not age play versus some that is?

KIT: I would imagine that most people who do the rubber latex thing tend to not go into the age play category like crossover. There’s always exceptions to the rule but, the people who tend to be the more latexy it doesn’t seem conducive to a little atmosphere.

MAKO: So they’re like a manniquin sort of?

KIT: Yeah. I can kind of picture…

MAKO: That’d be cool.

SPACEY: So, I want to definitely delve into that a little more. I’d like to set the stage here and learn a little more about you.

KIT: Ok.

SPACEY: I’d love to hear about, so how’d you get involved with dollification? What are the aspects that you really enjoy?

KIT: A lot of what started it for me was I think partially because I have a big fear of dolls. Like, actual dolls I don’t like. So like, being them kinda has that intimidation factor. Because dolls are creepy.

MAKO: Interesting.

KIT: Let’s see. And then a lot of it’s that I’m very into the gothic Lolita scene. So part of that with the porcelain dolls plays into that. It’s the getting to play dress-up that I like a lot.

SPACEY: Ok. That’s pretty cool.

MAKO: So I’m curious with your interest in dollification, is it, you’ll have to pardon me, I don’t have the words for it. As the person being dolled up or as the person doing the dolling, are there special words for that?

SPACEY: I’ve read a few.

KIT: Often it’s used, maker. Maker and dolly, or something like that. Maker and toy.

SPACEY: On one forum I was on referred to it as owner and doll.

KIT: Yeah. Owner, maker, even master.

MAE: Creator?

KIT: Creator, toy… Ya know, it’s very open. A lot of what I see is maker on dollification.com, and owner.

MAKO: Are you a dollification switch? Do you do both, or is there one side?

KIT: I prefer to just stay on the dolly side.

SPACEY: Ok.

KIT: Sometimes it’s fun to dress up other people, but I like to be dressed up.

SPACEY: So how long have you been doing this for?

KIT: Um, I’ve been researching and looking into things since I was like 16. So…

MAKO: So maybe you still had barbies at the time?

KIT: No.

MAKO: Laughs.

KIT: I got rid of those.

SPACEY: Then then I wonder, how did you find out there were other people that were interested in this and start pursuing it?

KIT: Google and stumble-upon.

SPACEY: Interesting.

KIT: And dollification websites and different erotica sites, and then Fetlife. It kind of branched out off of the D/s scene. So, it’s very much a typical D/s role play for a lot of people I think. And changing into just like a subset of role play, D/s kinda thing.

SPACEY: Right.

MAKO: See that’s really interesting to me because I think that age play is like that too, right? You can put someone in a diaper or call them your baby and you don’t have to do any kind of hitty smacky thing, but there’s power exchange going on.

KIT: Yep.

SPACEY: Indeed indeed. So interesting, we have a…

KIT: Nitrous has a question?

SPACEY: Yeah exactly, a question from the chatroom already. “Is it a huge girl thing or is it pretty even with the genders?”

KIT: From what I’ve learned it’s pretty even. There’s about the same amount of guys as there is girls. It’s a lot of guys wanting to be girl dolls. From what I’ve gathered. I mean, ya know…

MAKO: Are there girls that want to be boy action figures too?

KIT: I haven’t seen any but I’m sure there are. GI Jane.

MAKO: Yeah.

SPACEY: So are there any kind of events or gatherings for this kind of thing?

KIT: Not that I’ve seen.

SPACEY: Ok.

KIT: I mean, it kind of… I’d love a gathering. It’d be awesome.

MAKO: Do you consider it to be like a niche fetish? Is it uncommon?

KIT: It’s not uncommon but it’s hard to find people to match up with I think, because of everyone’s different definition or how they like to play dolly is so different.

MAKO: I could see that.

KIT: Because somebody else might be prim-popper Barbie and doesn’t wanna have their hair messed up while they’re playing dolly. It’s very detail oriented for a lot of people.

MAKO: I mean I can certainly see that everyone would do it there own way.

KIT: Yeah.

SPACEY: So do you have somebody that you play with on a regular basis? And how did you go about finding somebody to play with?

KIT: Um, not really. (laugh) There’s, yeah. Not been a lot of regular play. There’s a few people that I have played with occasionally. One of the girls is up in New Jersey. She’s a really good dolly, but it’s not very often.

SPACEY: Interesting.

MAKO: Is there… I know you said you use Fetlife. Is there one particular group that’s really good to find other dolly people?

KIT: There’s actually quite a few different groups. I know there’s a strictly dollification group.

MAKO: Oh brother you know what that is.

SPACEY: It’s a show note!

MAKO: SHOWNOTE! Yeah.

SPACEY: It’s a slightly lower pitched show note.

MAKO: (lower pitched) show note

KIT: There’s Dollplay, there’s Bound Dolls which is bondage and something else. There’s also Female Dollification, Fetish Dollies…

MAKO: So it sounds like dollification blends really well with things.

KIT: Mm hmm.

SPACEY: So I mean I’d like to hear more perhaps about… So you sort of talked about where you came from with it but what appeals to you about it? And, what would you be looking for in a scene that involved it?

KIT: For me it’d be a lot of restriction play, not being able to talk, or no blinking, or not being able to move, having to stay in one position unless you’re moved into another position. Like restrictive bondage but not with actual restriction.

MAKO: It’s mental bondage.

KIT: Yeah.

SPACEY: Is the discomfort… Because some of that obviously is gonna involve some level of discomfort. Is that part of what interest you about it?

KIT: A little bit.

SPACEY: Ok.

KIT: More just the control aspect.

SPACEY: So more about the kind of D/s of it?

KIT: Yeah.

MAKO: Ya know it’s funny, I…

KIT: The…

MAKO: I’m sorry go ahead Kit.

KIT: No go ahead.

MAKO: I was at an event where the other guests we were expecting tonight taught a class about this. So I know a little. And one of the things that she’d said in her class that was really fascinating to me was this thing about the robot and android aspect of this. That you could make people into like, sex dolls Or like a programmed love-slave, or simple automatons, where they can only do the instructions they are told to do. Ya know? So if you’re like “Walk forward,” and you don’t tell them to stop, they’re…

KIT: Running into the wall?

MAKO: Right.

Kit: Yeah.

MAKO: Or like, “Keep masturbating.” And they have to keep doing it even if it hurts.

MAE: “Slay vampires!”

MAKO: Well yeah. I find that kind of thing really fascinating. And one of the things they were talking about, it’s like a control mechanism. Do you ever do that? Are you puppetted? Do you ever have strings on you?

MAE: I was thinking about that, like the bondage.

KIT: I’ve found some really good videos where there’re girls tied up and being puppetted and having to stay in one position while ropes are going up. And, or being floppy and having to… And being puppetted about. It’s really hot.

SPACEY: So like, you mentioned some of what you’re interested in. What would you look for in a partner that you’d wanna play with involving this kind of thing?

KIT: Creativity. Similar fashion sense.

MAE: (Laughs)

KIT: For me as a doll, I don’t wanna be dressed in skanky clothes.

Laughter.

KIT: I want proper clothes. Or latex, latex doesn’t count as skanky. That’s ok.

Everyone laughs.

SPACEY: Let’s make sure we get that reported.

MAKO: Yeah.

SPACEY: That outfit is skanky, unless it’s latex.

KIT: Latex is ok.

MAE: Speaking We should get a latex…???

MAKO: Actually, Skanky Latex is one of my porn star names.

Laughter.

MAKO: Also another from the chatroom before like, Havarti bacon? Jalapeno bacon?

SPACEY: Aaaaaaanyway… Is the word we’re looking for there.

MAKO: Sorry. Um, ok…

KIT: So…

MAKO: Go ahead.

KIT: So like, similar fashion sense, and, I don’t know. And oh, they’d have to be good with rope. But ya know, that’s just cuz I like rope.

SPACEY: So is this something that you do on your own when you don’t have a partner?

KIT: It can. There’s a lot of people who do dolly play by themselves. I mean, basically just dress yourself up and take cute pictures and ya know, sit amongst the stuffed animals.

SPACEY: And does that, I mean do you do any of that? Does that evoke a certain headspace for you?

KIT: Sometimes. I have before. You kinda just get… It’s kinda like subspace, you get that mindless “OK” subbie feeling where you just kinda be.

SPACEY: yeah that’s a theme I’ve seen a lot in the forums and the places that I’ve visited. Sort of this mindlessness, this, not a thought in your head at all kinda thing. Is that something you experienced or something that you’d like to go for?

KIT: Mm hmm!

MAKO: It makes sense to me. I mean it’s a form of objectification right?

KIT: Yeah.

MAKO: So it’s no different then being a chair or being a table, only you can’t put an angora sweater on the table.

MAE: No…

KIT: (laughs)

SPACEY: You can.

MAKO: I mean on top of the table. Right. Right. Yeah It’d mess with my head.

SPACEY: If you wanna fold it.

Laughter

KIT: It would…

MAE: Coat rack.

MAKO: I know someone actually, and I don’t know if he’d call it dollification, but I think it’s kinda the same thing, and you know him too Brother. You know who I’m thinking of right?

SPACEY: Um, now?

MAKO: Ms. Lemon’s unit.

SPACEY: Oh ok.

MAE: Oh yeah.

SPACEY: He’s interested in objectification a bit.

MAKO: Yeah when he’s like in his unit gear, he’s not a person. He’s like a thing. He’s unit whatever the numbers are, and you chain him to a thing and, or like, make him sit some place, give him hard work to do and that’s what he does.

KIT: Yeah. For a lot of people it’s kind of how they’d normally be subbie, but it’s just a different name I guess.

SPACEY: Sort of reminds me of this the practice of meditation right? Where you’re trying to be present, but you don’t focus on your thoughts that you have, you try to let go.

MAKO: Mm hmm. Detachment.

SPACEY: I have to admit that that is… And it’s something that I’ve been trying to practice. I’ve been trying to establish this meditation sitting practice…

MAKO: That’s your problem Brother.

SPACEY: So I spend some time doing that every morning and accepting that thoughts come in and trying to let them go if they do. It’s a lot of, I won’t say it’s work, it’s a lot of…

MAKO: (laughs)

SPACEY: It’s non-effort effort?

MAKO: Yeah.

SPACEY: Is that the right word?

MAKO: It’s channeling.

SPACEY: It’s practice.

MAKO: Yeah it’s troublesome.

SPACEY: So do you ever find yourself in that state, where you really feel like you have no thought whatsoever? Is that something that sort of starts and stops for you? Do you have a sense of time when that happens? What’s that like?

KIT: Um, it’s kind of hard because my brain doesn’t like to stop. So it’s part of the reason why dollification’s so fun. There’ll be, you’ll lose track of time. You finish whatever you were doing and be like, “Oh! It’s been two and a half hours of me putting on different clothes! And doing my makeup! What happened?”

SPACEY: It’s like playing video games

KIT: Yeah.

Laughing

MAKO: So you can be the maker and the doll kind of at the same time, right?

KIT: Yeah.

MAKO: That’s like a form of masturbation. Dolli-turbation I guess.

SPACEY: Nice.

KIT: Costumbation?

MAKO: Yeah! Ok so, a question. So, where does this happy little party meet up with the age playing? As you said.

KIT: Well, before I delved into the idea of littles and dolls playing like, getting a doll for Christmas and you have this brand new doll to play with. You get to unwrap her, and you have all these different outfits you can dress her up in and do naughty things to her, and have a tea party. It’s basically you have a doll and you could just play with her as your toy, like you would your normal toys., which could be fun, only naughtier.

MAKO: Ok. I’m totally taking advantage of the show…

KIT: Ok.

MAKO: But I wanna ask you for something actually.

KIT: Hmm?

MAKO: I have a wonderful idea for Bouncy Town, the age play village for Fetfest next year.

KIT: Ok.

MAKO: We could have you be the village doll! People could play with you for an hour or two.

KIT: Hmm!

MAKO: Bring clothes to dress up the doll with, ya know?

SPACEY: Ooh we could play Operation!

Laughter

MAKO: Or tea party.

SPACEY: Ah ok.

MAE: Candyland!

KIT: Tea party?

MAKO: Yeah.

SPACEY: Get the markers out, yay! Cut the hair!

Laughing.

SPACEY: This could go well…???

KIT: Actually if I’m still in the mood for cutting my hair for Cancer I could be into that.

MAE: Oh ok! Go Spacey!

MAKO: So not that I’m gonna hold you to it and make you give me an answer now, but let’s talk about it.

KIT: I could get behind that.

SPACEY: That does remind me of camp… I think it was the first year we went to camp, they built that box…

MAE: Barbie box, yeah.

MAKO: The Barbie box!

SPACEY: And then the next year they painted it and put the big Barbie sing on it, exactly.

MAE: Yeah.

SPACEY: That was quite popular for people to put their submissives into that box for a little while.

MAE: …???

SPACEY: Or tickle them while they’re inside the box because it has holes in strategic places. Or to shoot water guns at them while they’re in the box.

MAKO: …??? So mean.

KIT: Oh goodness.

MAKO: And the holes in the box turned out to be actually really convenient, cuz it was frickin hot in there!

Laughing.

SPACEY: Plus it was just funny.

MAKO: Yeah.

MAE: Oh my.

SPACEY: But yeah I remember that. And it strikes me as like, there’s a lot of potential overlay right? So as you mentioned, Kit, there’s having a toy and playing with your toys kind of thing, but I think even being a toy could be an age play experience.

KIT: Yeah! I mean… Go ahead.

SPACEY: I was just thinking that scene that I saw at Beyond Vanilla where the person was being dressed up in these cute little dresses that suggested age play like, sort of Lolita style dresses and that kind of thing. They were fascinating to me.

MAKO: yeah. I am fascinated by it, and it strikes me as being really accessible to age players.

KIT: Mm hmm.

MAKO: It’s a real easy form of pretend. But I don’t know…

KIT: You could, hmm?

MAKO: What ages have you… I’m curious about sort of your background as an age player too, and like, things you’ve done that use them both, or ways that they came together that you were surprised.

KIT: Um, I haven’t really gotten to do much crossover between the age play and dolly stuff. I’m very new to the age play scene. So…

SPACEY: Well talk to me more about what appeals to you…

KIT: I don’t know how to answer that…

SPACEY: In age play, what made you think this is something you’d like to be involved with as well?

KIT: Like, school girl stuff. It’s the younger role play aspect for the most part. The coloring, the Disney, mostly the Disney.

SPACEY: (Laughs) I’m a big fan of the Disney world I’ll tell you.

KIT: Yeah, Disneyland’s my favorite place.

SPACEY: Disneyland’s pretty cool too.

KIT: And the bratting, I mean you can’t really brat as a doll, because you’re supposed to be a doll, and dolls don’t brat.

MAE: No Ms. Sassypants for you.

SPACEY: I could think of an exception to that. What if you had one of those pull-string dolls that says rude things for instance?

MAKO: (laugh)

MAE: Ms. Sassypants…

KIT: I’d love to…???

MAKO: “There’s a snake in my pants!”

Loud laughter.

MAKO: Actually, is Toystory like, porn for doll people?

KIT: Um, probably… I don’t know.

Laughter.

MAE: Yes?

SPACEY: Yes no maybe kinda sorta…

KIT: I’m thinking I’m like, well…

SPACEY: I’m gonna have to go back to the wisdom of a previous streamie. Everything is porn to someone.

KIT: Yeah.

MAE: There’s one scene in Toystory 2 where I think, I don’t remember the girly version of Woodie? What’s her name?

Jessie.

MAKO: Jessie.

MAE: Jessie’s kinda having this flashback to her owner and her days as the girl with the pony.

MAKO: Right.

KIT: …???

MAE: It kinda reminded me of a combination of doll play and pony play.

SPACEY: Again, it goes to show you that doll play could mix with a lot of different kinds of play.

MAE: Yeah.

SPACEY: Could certainly…

MAE: Carousel play.

SPACEY: So, one of the groups that I checked out on Fetlife was the Dollification group, and there’s a sticky note at the very beginning that says “NO ROBOTS!”

KIT: WHAT?!

SPACEY: Exactly, so what is that about?

KIT: I don’t know. Which group? I’m gonna look.

MAE: I think it’s Dollification and Dollers?

SPACEY: Yeah.

MAE: It’s one of the ones with the biggest membership.

KIT: Hmmmmm.

SPACEY: So…

MAKO: It’s like a Cantina thing. “We don’t want nunna your robots in here!”

KIT: I don’t know!

SPACEY: What defines a robot as opposed to a doll?

KIT: I don’t know, I’ve never heard anything about that. I mean, I guess a robot would be like metallic and shiny and…

SPACEY: C3PO.

KIT: I guess they’d be able to talk or something.

MAE: Remote control’s the first thing that comes to my mind.

KIT: Yeah.

MAE: Or movement on its own.

KIT: Yeah. Because there’s so many different ideas on what’s for dollies, I’m surprised that there’s a sticky that says no robots.

SPACEY: Although, I think I know what defines a robot. It’s this sound. Dvr’r’ruuut! Dvr’r’ruuuuut! Dvr’ruut dvr’ruuut dvr’ruuuuuuuuut!

KIT: that would get on my nerves if I had a dolly that did that.

SPACEY: There ya go!

Laughter.

SPACEY: Now, it was an interesting kind of thing but it struck me as one of those where the lines were kinda blurred. Now, I will say that I don’t think that this is a biased thing like, they think robots are bad on that group or anything, they just for some reason don’t want to have discussions about it. In fact, the people who operate that group also operate a group for robots.

KIT: Ok.

SPACEY: But it seems…

MAKO: Does that group have a sticky that says “NO DAMN DOLLIES!”?

Laughter.

SPACEY: I don’t know, Dollies Of The Damned, that could be fun.

KIT: Ah like the Island Of The Dolls. So creepy.

SPACEY: Now I’m a little disappointed, I wanted to know more about robots.

KIT: Yeah I don’t really delve into robot play. Thought it’d be cool to have cables and stuff to be plugged in to you.

SPACEY: So a lot of what I’ve seen is this sort of being forced into the doll role. Like a lot of people like to be “forced” into the younger little’s role. I don’t know maybe some people like to be forced into the big role for that matter, I haven’t seen it, but I can see it happening. But it seemed to be a theme I saw at a lot of places like, on that group there was a link to a Youtube video. It was this lady being forced into being a doll because the makeup she put on was hardening and making her become a doll. I’ve seen a lot of references to hypnosis as sort of a form of this forced control. It seems to kind of go hand in hand, do you know anything more about that?

KIT: The fantasy aspect has a lot of the hardening gel and like, the manikin-type thing going on where people end up not being able to move or they have plastic skin, or… That fills the fetish scene for dollification. I’m trying to figure out how to… There’s a lot of kidnap-type things when that goes along. Kind of that, stolen away and made into a doll and, “Oh, now you’re my doll for the rest of your life! You can’t get away, you can’t even move, you can’t even blink…” That type of thing. Trying to think… What was your other question?

SPACEY: I guess it seems like those things kind of go hand in hand quite a bit. I just wondered if you had any knowledge or experience about that. And does that factor into the kind of play that you like to do?

KIT: Um, sort of. There’s aspects about it where I could see playing it out, but that’s not one of the huge things for me. A lot of it’s the dress-up. But, you’d mentioned hypnosis?

SPACEY: Mm hmm.

KIT: And, I don’t have any experience with that but I know a lot of people into dollification who are. It helps go with things, because you can’t be hypnotized to do things you really don’t want to do.

MAKO: Right.

KIT: It doesn’t happen, it’s just a way to let yourself subconscious relax. So, a lot of people will use dollification to have a catatonic-type state to where you can’t move without being placed that way because you don’t… It makes your brain…

MAKO: So it sounds like that it’s not so much about like when you are in, um, dollspace, that you’re gonna fight it and have to be beaten down into it. You’re sort of transformed.

KIT: Mm hmm.

MAKO: And once you’re in the space, you’re stuck.

KIT: Yep.

SPACEY: And…

KIT: Cuz it…

SPACEY: Go ahead.

KIT: Dollies can’t fight back so once you’re a doll, you’re kind of stuck being a doll no matter what’s going on.

MAKO: I guess maybe part of the appeal of it is it’s a really accessible form of objectification. Like, you can say someone’s a chair or a table or a footstool, go over there and be a footstool. But they still look like a person. There’s a person being a table, ya know? But if you hold your face the right way or wear the right clothes or have a porcelain mask on you can be a doll.

KIT: Yep.

SPACEY: That does strike me as something else that I read quite a bit is that blank expression is often important to a lot of people. There were whole photo sets that I wouldn’t think had anything to do with doll play except the people had this blank expression on their faces. And that’s what really seemed to draw people in.

KIT: Yeah. A lot of people are… Because it kind of makes you this lifeless thing. If you have a blank face of if you have like, crazy contacts. Crazy contacts are one of my things that I like. I don’t know if anybody else knows about scleras that completely black out your eyes…

SPACEY: Shownotes!

MAKO: SHOWNOTES!

KIT: But they give you this… It makes you look not real. I mean, if anybody’s seen Halloween contacts, it takes a normal person to, “What’s wrong with them?”

MAKO: Oh yeah…

KIT: Like, I don’t know.

MAKO: I’m very familiar with them. I had a pair of cats-eye contact lenses that I wore for Halloween costume one year. It was a very simple very effective costume. I glued these giant latex devil’s horns on my forehead and I don't have a lot of hair up there so that was easy. And I put on these cats-eye contact lenses, and I looked like something that had been dragged from the pits of Hell. It was amazing. I remember I put them on in the mall and people… This mom dragged her child away from me. It was really funny.

SPACEY: Strikes Me as a scene from, was that Michael Jackson video, Thriller?

MAKO: Oh right!

KIT: Yeah.

SPACEY: (evil laugh) WHAHAHAHA!

MAKO: Right!

KIT: I have Halloween contacts that I’ve worn out and it’s just really entertaining to have people catch you. Because if you look completely normal except for like one side of your face where you have some crazy makeup and one contact, they just can’t stop staring. It really puts people off and kind of changes what you look like. So, that has a lot of appeal for me in the lifestyle, in dollification.

MAKO: So is it an an exhibitionist thing for you? You wanna do it to be seen?

KIT: With some things. I worked at a Halloween event where there was a doll maze. And that was a big draw. If I’d gotten to be a doll in there? Oh my gosh. Because it’s a creepy thing like, the creep-out factor has a lot of draw to me with dolls.

MAKO: Really cool.

KIT: A lot of people, I don’t know, a lot of people wanna be pretty dolls. But I like creepy dolls too. Like, broken and creepy dolls. (Laugh)

MAKO: Where are your limits with this? What are the tings that you’re like, “I’ll do this and that’s fine, but we can’t ever do that!”

KIT: Uuuuuum… I don’t know. (Laugh)

MAKO: Well aside from skanky clothing that’s not latex.

KIT: Well, Um… I don’t know. I’m trying to think. Hypnotism doesn’t really have a big draw for me.

MAKO: Well ok here’s a for instance for you.

KIT: Ok.

MAKO: Let’s say that I had you, as the Bouncy Town doll at Fetfest, and you were dressed in some nice outfit that we supplied for you, I’m not an A-hole, and then the kids came up and, spilled juice and mud and cake on it and like, ripped it off you. Or wanted to drag you around on the ground and bonk your head and your face on things?

KIT: Uuuummm, technically I’d be ok with that. If I was in that sort of space, I mean, it’d be ok. And if it wasn’t my clothes it’d be ok because… (Laugh). My dolly clothes I like to take care of.

SPACEY: Ahh.

MAKO: Oh. Valentalae, who is a genius, just brought up a very nice point. Do you ever, as a dolly, let the person playing with you put you in a diaper?

SPACEY: (Laugh)

KIT: I don’t do diapers.

MAKO: Ah! Looks like we found a limit!

KIT: Oh, yeah.

SPACEY: Which actually brings up… This discussion is kind of negotiation, so, what kinds of things would you or do you negotiate when you’re gonna be involved in a doll play scene?

KIT: Um, basic limits like any other normal limits you’d have. For me, needles… Yeah.

SPACEY: Needles, apparently diapers.

MAKO: Right.

KIT: Yeah.

MAKO: So Betsy-wetsy play is out for you?

KIT: Yeah. I don’t do needles, I don’t like blood, I don’t like pee, I don’t like scat, ya know.

SPACEY: How about sexual stimulation?

KIT: With the person, it’d depend on the person.

MAKO: How about gum in your fake hair?

SPACEY: (laugh)

KIT: In my fake hair. If I had fake hair.

MAKO: Or in your real hair.

KIT: In my real hair, no! Because that’s a pain and a half to get out.

SPACEY: And you’d have to do that when you shave your head.

KIT: Yes.

MAKO: Do you ever wear a wig when you’re a dolly?

KIT: I have not worn a wig, but that was because I cannot afford the wigs I want. So, that’s one of the tings on the list for dolly stuff. I want some crazy wigs. But it’s hard to find wigs that fit right. Because I have a weird-shaped head.

SPACEY: Awww.

KIT: (Laugh)

SPACEY: Be nice to yourself.

MAKO: Yeah.

KIT: But it’s one of those… Definitely no gum in the hair. No gum in the hair.

MAKO: (Laugh)

KIT: Little kids should not chew gum.

SPACEY: Another one of the things that we’ve sort of been talking about is how this blends with other forms of play. Objectification I think we’ve hit, that’s been really obvious. But I’ve seen a lot of overlap with guys that wanna be treated as girl dolls as you’ve mentioned, so sissification I guess is part of this for a lot of people?

KIT: Mm hmm. Also, I’m trying to find the right words. Bimbo… I wanna say ization… Ication?

MAKO: Bimbo-if-ication?

KIT: Bim-bo-ification?

SPACEY: Bim-boff-ication?

MAKO: That’s my favorite dish at the Korean barbecue!

KIT: (Laugh)

KIT: Bimbo people?

MAKO: (Laugh)

KIT: A lot of people wanting to be made into barbie bimbo type toys, ya know. With big pink puckered lips and crazy blond hair and a really tight dress and HUGE knockers. Like, HUUUUUUGE! So like, that’s often part of it.

SPACEY: Now I wanna know who achieves, “HUUUUUGE!” knockers.

MAKO: Right.

KIT: HUGE knockers. Like, I don’t know if you’ve seen the inflatable outfits that often come with… Certain people in the latex scene. Where they have the big fake inflatable boobs on their outfits.

SPACEY: Ok. So balloons.

KIT: Yeah, they’re basically giant balloons.

SPACEY: Well ya know, balloon encasement is a fetish as well, I wonder if that kinda goes along with doll play.

KIT: I think it would. There’re people who are into like… Furries could probably go into it because it’d go into like being a teddy bear. You could have people who are into stuffed animals and who like to be a doll with a teddy bear. Or stuff like that.

MAKO: See now that’s really interesting to me, because I think that there’s a big distinction between fursuiting and being a babyfur and being like, a plushy dolly. I think they’re different things.

KIT: I think they’d be different things but I still think they’d be crossover between that. I mean, I don’t know, I don’t have a huge knowing of the furry community. So, just throwing that out there.

SPACEY: There’s potential crossovers. Things other folks might be interested in for sure. How about folks that are interested in, merely as say, being fashion models. They wanna be the doll, the manikin in the window at the store, that kind of thing?

KIT: Yeah, I think the term for that is, ag-o-lo-mo-philia?

SPACEY: Wow, that’s a show note.

MAKO: Wow, SHOWNOTE!

KIT: I have it on my fetish list. …??? Ag-o-lo-mo-to-philia-ism… Which is like, being a maniquin.

SPACEY: Not a maniquin depressive or anything just a maniquin.

MAKO: Oh God Brother that’s terrible.

MAKO: That’s if you’re really depressed that you’re partner’s into dollification, you’re a maniquin depressive.

KIT: Ooooooh God.

MAKO: Terrible.

SPACEY: (Cartoon failure sound) Wom-wom!

KIT: I mean some people are really into like, being in the window. Wanting to be in the window in the clothes.

SPACEY: And I guess some people get to do that for a real life job, right? That’s a real job, I’ve seen people do that before.

KIT: I’ve done that before.

MAKO: Oh like being a human maniquin?

KIT: Yeah.

MAKO: Oh my God so, were you completely turned on while you were doing that?

KIT: Um, no. It was more silly. Had the day been a better day it probably would’ve been more fun, but I was not having a good day that day.

MAKO: Awww.

KIT: But we’d taken part in a… One of the groups I was in took part in a modeling at Torrid. Everybody got to put on clothes that were in the store at the time and we stood in the windows and we posed. It was entertaining because people would walk by and then they’d, we’d shift a little, and they’d be like, “What? Oh that’s a person!” And it’d startle people. It was really entertaining.

SPACEY: Yeah I would totally be tempted to do that until somebody unsuspecting came up and then go “BOO!”

KIT: Yeah.

MAKO: (Laugh)

KIT: I did a bit of that.

SPACEY: (Laugh)

MAKO: I think that’s really neat.

SPACEY: Oh you know what, there are… That reminds me of like… People do that professionally like, at Disney World. Right?

MAKO: Right the human statues.

SPACEY: There are human statues at Disney World. There’s Divine at the animal kingdom is this sort of living plant thing that sort of poses and people just walk by until it moves and goes “Boo!”

MAKO: Which is awesome.

KIT: The street performers in Vegas where they’re painted silver would technically count. I don’t know if they’re getting sexual pleasure out of that but, ya know. It’s definitely a form of doll play. Or robot play or like, statue play.

MAKO: It’s interesting too because I think that it really surprises me that it’s hard to find other doll players because it seems really accessible and friendly and frankly… I think that a lot of fetishes are on the far side of the yard away from the vanilla street. But I think this one’s like right next to the sidewalk.

KIT: It’s right next to the sidewalk, definitely! I mean a lot of people kind of dabble in it with costumes at Halloween and there’s certainly a bit of play with it.

SPACEY: Raggedy Ann’s gotta be the most common form of doll play there is.

MAKO: Yeah.

KIT: Yep. I’ve actually found a really good story on dollification.com that is Raggedy Ann based.

MAKO: SHOWNOTE!

KIT: SHOWNOTE!

MAKO: I remember when I was a kid, I loved Raggedy Ann and Andy stories, and there was a whole thing in there about how, I think it was either Raggedy Ann or Raggedy Andy had to go throug this like, spanking machine of people? They were like, whacking him all over.

KIT: Really?

MAKO: But it didn’t hurt him because he’s just made of fluff because he’s just a doll.

KIT: Mm hmm.

MAKO: And that definitely pushed spanking and age play buttons for me and I…??? A little dollification too!

SPACEY: We’re gonna start objectifying my brother!

MAKO: Yay!

SPACEY: Or my thing.

MAKO: (Laugh) I’m your thing. Do what you wanna do.

SPACEY: Think we’re gonna just wrap this up.

MAKO: Ok. Did we miss anything Kit? Is there something you particularly want us to talk about?

KIT: Um, no. Make up your own definition if you’re interested in playing with dollification. I mean, it’s any type of doll that you’re interested in messing around with, go for it. You could be a muppet and have muppet jokes and you could be a puppet like Raven said. Take it where you wanna go.

SPACEY: Awesome. I think that’s great advice.

MAKO: Yeah.

SPACEY: More things than just dollification. So, how can folks get in touch with you?

KIT: Fetlife works. There’s a link on the podcast event if anyone wants to it’s… Let me… I’m trying to figure out how to… Kit Koppélia, K-I-T-K-O-P-P-É-L-I-A at Fetlife.

SPACEY: Yeah. So, but there’s bunches of ways to get in touch with us right?

MAKO: Sure are. Let’s see. You can visit our website, biglittlepodcast.com, where you can listen to previous shows and subscribe to our mailing list where we’ll let you know when new shows come out.

SPACEY: Actually reminds me, we’ve gotten some questions. People who follow us on iTunes or otherwise subscribe to our RSS feed for the shows have noticed that some of our older shows aren’t showing up on that feed anymore. And that’s because our feed only shows the last 50 shows. Feed is the thing that gets requested all the time when those things wanna update and decide where whether or not there are new shows to bring down. And so, we have to keep that relatively short. 50 is a pretty big number as feeds go. But all those episodes are still available on the website.

MAKO: Which is why you should go there.

SPACEY: That’s right. If you still wanna hear episode number 1, 2, 3 or the other ones that have fallen off the list, just go to our website, go find those episodes and take a listen. They’re still there, you can download them and keep them for your own personal enjoyment, comfort and getting a little thrill and objectifying my brother.

MAKO: Sure. But if you want to find out about new shows, antoehr great way to get in touch with us and be a part of the show is you can follow us on the Twitter where we are biglittlepdcast, because our Twitter name’s a bit too big-little for Twitter. What other ways are there, Brother, for people to find us?

SPACEY: While you’re looking for us you can also look for us on Fetlife.

MAKO: Woohoo!

SPACEY: Where we have a group called Big Little Podcast. A hard one to figure out, just type it there in the search bar, if it’s the Big Little Podcast group, you’re in the right place.

MAKO: That’s right. But probably our biggest most favoritest way for you to get in touch with us is to call the show line which is 678-421-4256. But if you do, please be sure to let us know it’s ok to use it on the show.

SPACEY: Alright, and that’s gonna do it for our show. Thanks so much for joining us today, Kit! And thank you everyone so much for listening.

MAKO: Thanks everyone!

SPACEY: Yaaaaay!

KIT: Yaaay!

MAE: Wooooo!

MAKO: Kermit arms, wooooo!

SPACEY: That’d be the Muppet play right?

MAKO: Right.

(Laughter)

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